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Sharon Redfern
| | Posted on Thursday, 7 August, 2008 - 1:11 pm: | |
Allowing people to drive more than once is a good idea as it moves the sport forward, but for me, even more importantly, would be to allow drivers to groom for each other and grooms to be allowed to groom for more than one driver at an event, it is so difficult to find people to do this essential job, and as Rita has said, the Indoor allow it, and has suceeded in gaining more entries, please please please change this very out of date rule, i have missed events this year because of it. |
Fiona Powell
| | Posted on Monday, 4 August, 2008 - 1:16 pm: | |
There are a number of issues which need debating, I think.
If drivers go round more than once then grooms must be allowed to do the same, as Julie says. There aren't always enough people with the right experience to help, so do we allow a driver who's already driven the course to backstep? We do in our club. Scheduling becomes very tricky if you can't be flexible about this. And you can't finish scoring a class until everyone in it has finished and any queries have been resolved. (This is probably easier at three-day events as only the cones scores are needed. Scheduling classes to avoid unnecessary cones width changes should be fun!)
My experience at club events is that people going hors concours are usually doing it to gain experience for themselves or for the horse without the pressure of being in the competition proper. While I can think of three or four "ordinary" people who might wish to compete twice and who have two competitive turnouts, it's still very hard work and might, as Martyn claims, change the nature of the sport.
My tuppence-worth is that this is a promising idea which needs to be intelligently thought through. It should not disadvantage people with only one turnout. Yes, it saves travel costs but adding £100 or so even for a half-price entry is still significantly off-putting for most people.
If the main aim of making this change is to increase entries at national events, I think that publicising the sport and encouraging more people into it to improve the competition are important long-term goals. |
Ian Gilbert
| | Posted on Friday, 1 August, 2008 - 12:15 pm: | |
At the Council meeting held at Catton,the subject of Drivers competing twice at the same event was discussed.
Council decided that such an important issue should be on the Agenda for the conference in October,so that members could have the chance to express their views.
Chairman Competitions Committee |
Rita Bundock
| | Posted on Friday, 1 August, 2008 - 11:29 am: | |
We have taken second entries at Normanhurst and Brighton, OK they went HC, but it did not cause any real problems. Why do classes have to go in order for the marathon? providing horses and pony classes are not mixed (they have different time allowances) there is no real reason to say No to a second entry. It might cause the competitor a few headaches if both entries are in the same class. Dressage and Marathon times are easily sorted but the cones could cause a problem for the competitor especially if the class is small, but there are ways around this.
Not only would this increase entries but also increase the revenue for the event to pay the ever increasing costs of running events, the added bonus - happy competitors.
We have done this Indoors for quiet a few years now, plus letting competitors backstep for each other and grooms on more than one vehicle. Competitors share vehicles, it is quiet amazing how quickly competitors can change vehicles AND do it properly and safely. It works Indoor and there is no reason for it not to work outdoors.
All this increases entries and makes the event a little safer for the following year, but also saves competitors time and money. |
Amanda Nisbet
| | Posted on Wednesday, 30 July, 2008 - 9:58 am: | |
I have been suggesting for years that we should join the other equestrian disciplines and allow more than one entry from a competitor. I have even mentioned it at Council and was told that it would be impossible! At our local clubs we quite often have more than one entry providing its in a different class. I orignally asked for this at the Indoors early on, only for other people to express horror and that it would be a huge advantage! As Julie says, no turnout is ever the same so how can it be. Thankfully Dick Carey agreed that 2 entries were acceptable and had the foresight to allow this. Its an ideal way to bring on young horses and still be competitive with another entry. I strongly suggest that Clubs allow this and then it maybe taken forward to National level. |
Martyn Willis
| | Posted on Monday, 28 July, 2008 - 10:43 pm: | |
If competitors are allowed to compete more than once without being HC on any subsequent turnout. I believe the sport will become professional.
Those competitors who only have one turnout will end up being disillusioned and may well give up. The reason for the new class structure was to open up competition and give everyone a chance.
Perhaps if someone is going HC their entry fee should be halve the full entry fee and a completion ribbon should be given. |
Fiona Bonney
| | Posted on Monday, 28 July, 2008 - 3:16 pm: | |
Allowing competitors to compete more than once has many advantages. True the entry costs are more, but the overheads are halved if you factor in travelling and all the other misc costs. With travel now so expensive, it would be really interesting to get two chances to compete, almost for the price of one. Both drivers and horses would gain experience more quickly and events would get more entries. Obviously there are some limitations on scheduling, but it is still well worth giving it a trial and see how it goes. |
Julie Hoskyns
| | Posted on Sunday, 27 July, 2008 - 8:30 pm: | |
You are right Fiona. If we could lower the entry fee AND allow everyone who choses to go round twice I think we would encourage more. |
Fiona Powell
| | Posted on Sunday, 27 July, 2008 - 7:23 pm: | |
I agree that drivers going round twice in the competition can encourage more entries and this would be an interesting experiment.
Indoor driving trials allow for a driver to compete in two classes (and qualify for the finals) and for grooms to go round more than once. We also enable people to go round more than once at our club events (but, so far, only hors concours the second time although Jill's idea has been suggested in our club). Schedulers will have a wonderful time with this: it is possible...
However it's only about £30 indoors and £59 per "go" at two-day club events. It seems to me that the nationals' entry fee of £130 plus £20 start fee for intermediate drivers or £170 plus £40 for a pairs entry might be putting people off rather more than any other factor? That's a minimum of £300 for a single and £420 for a pair driver to go round twice...
I support a debate on this subject yet consider that lowering the cost of entry would encourage a lot more (and new) competitors and hence better competition. How will our sport survive if it continues to rely on the same people all the time?
As they say, discuss? |
Julie Hoskyns
| | Posted on Friday, 25 July, 2008 - 1:50 pm: | |
Well said Jill.You should ALL read her letter in Carriage Driving (Aug) and maybe we could start a healthy disscussion. Jill is absalutly right, it is time we looked into allowing people to compete more than once and allowing grooms to go round the marathon more than once. I can not see how it would give an advantage to have driven the course beforehand as we are ALL able to walk the course AND the TD info is explicit often telling us where the finish of a section is and what to look out for. Eventers, show jumpers and dressage riders can all compete more than once and it is not considered to be an unfair advantage so why can't we? I hear the cry that we will know the course better, where the finish of the section is and be able to rectify faults made in our first round BUT every horse and turnout are different, they all have different strengths and weeknesses and in our case are driven accordingly, so there is no real unfair advantage to be had.
The advantages could be huge, boosting entries and as Jill quite rightly points out we could maximize space and fuel costs. There seems no logic in charging competitors the full entry fee to take a turnout round HC and not be allowed to win a £3.00 rossette at the end of it. We may also up our game internationally as driver/trainers could compete and assist their pupils on the course without having to forefit their class. |
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