| Author | Message | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
     Guest |
The H&H article has put the cat amongst the pigeons. It quotes Sally Moreton as saying that they went to a lot of trouble to make sure R.Buck had nothing to do with the singles yet he himself admits to giving the selectors his opinion in confidence. Who can we believe? Mike and Douglas's last two message make it absolutely clear that the Selectors have failed to supply this Country with the best possible chance of success at the Championships. For heavens sake what else should Ms Denney have done to get selected? Pete B | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Mike Watts |
See Horse and Hound article about this, here: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/competitionnews/389/125578.html | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Mike Watts |
There have been comments in this thread about not understanding the scoring used at the worlds. Is this correct: in each class, e.g. the single pony, we take the best marathon, the best cones and the best dressage. ('best' of our two competitors)? If this is correct, then a person who is the best at two phases, e.g. cones and marathon, is an automatic choice for the team. It's obvious, but I can post a simple mathematical proof based on the expectation scores. I imagine that everyone who's posted on this subject wishes our team the best of luck and recognises them as good competitors. However, there are still concerns about the system. While I doubt if anyone would expect this year's to be changed, it's reasonable to expect to be able to understand it and to air any concerns to be taken into account next time a [selection] system is chosen. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Douglas Strachan |
Comments by Grumpy Old Man Douglas Strachan on BHDTA Statement on Pony Team Selection Before explaining my curiosity on the selection of the Single Pony Representatives I should declare that at the time of determining the Selection Procedure I was not in favour of it but was assured that this was what the potential team members wished. I was also conscious that it placed an onerous task on the panel as they would require to be represented at all training and selection events in their own time and at their own expense. I am most grateful for their efforts on behalf of BHDTA but this does not stop me from expressing an opinion on the selection of the Single Pony Representatives The Rules stated that Potential Drivers must compete at four out of six nominated events and that "selection will be made on the basis of observation at the selection events" The rules also stated "Other considerations, such as experience……. will be taken into account if final selection is not clear cut" (my italics) Recognising the BHDTA Statement that "first past the post" was not the criteria for selection and that selection was based on how the Championship would be marked, I have produced two tables. I hope my arithmetic is correct but my faculties are failing and they may need verifying but I hope the pattern is evident. I considered the three phases of Dressage, Marathon and Cones and giving 10 marks for first in each phase, then 9 for second etc
Using the above this can be summarised (without any weighting of the phases)
As a simple soul considering the three phases of Dressage, Marathon and Cones, the above would indicate that Sue and Sarah should be going to Denmark as their records are "clear cut" (my italics) For the record, I have never agreed with the Scottish Rugby Selectors either as my leather rugby boots are still hanging in the garage !!!!! I hope that I am proved wrong and that Jill and her team better the Catton Bronze. G.O.M Douglas Strachan | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
I HAVE READ ALL THESE POSTS RE THE SELECTION PROCESS AND FEEL THAT I NEED TO ADD A COMMENT. I CONCIDER MYSELF A FRIEND OF SARA, SUE AND JULIE. I HAVE BEEN COMPETING IN THE OPEN PONY CLASS FOR MANY YEARS. I WAS AT CAMBRIDGE WHEN THE SELECTION PROCESS WAS VOTED IN.I PUT MYSELF UP FOR SELECTION. THE TEAM TO REPRESENT OUR COUNTRY HAS BEEN SELECTED. IT CAN NOT AND WILL NOT BE CHANGED. SURELY EVERYONE CAN STOP THIS BICKERING AND ALLOW THE TEAM TO RELAX AND GET READY FOR DENMARK. WE VOTED IN OUR SELECTORS. WEATHER WE LIKE THEIR DECISION OR NOT THEY HAVE MADE THEIR DECICION AND WE NEED TO BACK THEM.THEY HAVE GIVEN THEIR TIME FREELY,AND I FOR ONE BELEAVE THAT THEY HAVE NOT BEEN INFULANCED BY ANY OTHER FACTORS. THIS THREAD SHOULD NOW FINISH, IF SOMEONE WISHES TO MAKE COMMENTS RE THE STRUCTOR OF THE BHDTA THEN PERHAPS A NEW THREAD SHOULD BE OPENED. OTHER THAN SAYING SORRY FOR MY SPELLING, I WISH EVERYONE IN THE TEAM THE VERY BEST OF LUCK AT DENMARK, AND THOSE THAT DIDNT MAKE IT THE BEST OF LUCK FOR NEXT TIME.X HEATHER WATT (KINNER) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
i think by reading the results and spectar that sue deny has been bullied because the selectors dont wont her to go. they are recking/spoiling the sport by putting peaple off like sue why should she compete in every compeition win 98% of the time and not get in the national team at least as an indervidual. sue denys and sarah howe have an less average than julie camm and liz rown and they have done more events.I have will also be taking this further by contacting by BHDTA and ackin why she has been cheated off the team. john A | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
Well said Jane! I wasn't going to add any more to this thread but it seems clear that people don't really understand the basis of the scoring at the pony world championships and how that influenced the choice of selection procedure. There are individual placings but the team score is made up of the best dressage from the singles, pairs and fours, the best marathon from each and the best cones. At the first worlds in Karlstetton it was clear the other nations (especially the Germans) had chosen their team particularly with this in mind. So, while it is true that for any score to count in any phase the competitor must complete the competition, it makes sense to choose a dressage specialist, if you have one, from each class, a marathon specialist and both to be able to do the cones. What we realised after Catton was that had we been able to choose a team on this basis then we would probably have been in gold medal position! We would have been able to take Julie Camms' dressage in the singles (had she been able to complete the competition) and Anna Graystons' in the fours. I would imagine that this is what the selectors were looking at when they chose the team ie how to get a gold medal for Great Britain rather than fulfill individual aspirations. A first past the post selection meant that you get good all rounders but not specialists and while that meant the individual might do well, the nation might not. The current procedure was designed to enable the selectors to choose on this basis but also not penalise those who maybe didn't do well in a particular competition because of maybe a carriage failure ( as happened to Chrissie Nash in 2005) and also to include those who had a great pony but could not compete in the first year as it was still developing. This I guess is what has happened in Julie's case - she did not compete this pony last year very much as he was still learning the job and to have pushed him to win competitions last year would have been detrimental to his long term development. So actual placings in the 'selection' events was never going to be the overriding factor in choosing the team, they were perhaps mistakenly called selection events in the first place because what they were was opportunities for each competitor to show their prowess in each phase to the selectors and for the trainers to help identify where each person needed to improve, or maintain, to enhance their chances of selection. Good results last year got you on the A-list for this year but you still had to perform this year to get selected because this year is the year of the competition and your ponies need to be fit, well and at the peak of their performance. Nuff said now, I wish everyone on the team the very best of luck. Rosemary Neale | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
As a regular club open pony driver and a supporter of a friend in the national open pony - who was not up for selection I hasten to add - I have followed this subject with interest. Although I have not been to any of the selection events this year, I too was surprised that Sue Denney was not selected. BUT - and it's a very big but - I have not seen what the selectors, trainers and vets have been able to see on an on-going basis and therefore, like the majority of those on the side-lines, my opinion is NOT an informed one! I can understand how Sue Denney - or any one else on the short list for that matter - must feel disappointed, it's a great honour to represent your country. But throwing your toys out of the pram in such a public way does nothing for yourself or your sport. I do not envy the selectors their job and it is very predictable that whatever selection criteria are chosen, you will not please all of the people all of the time, so to speak. I imagine that Sue Denney will have been afforded the same opportunities to attend the training sessions along with everyone else on the list to try and improve her dressage, should that be perceived as being necessary. Should I have been in a position to put my name down on the long list it would have been worth it to me for this chance alone! Assuming Sue Denney had this advantage, it surely can't have come as a surprise at the last minute to hear that her dressage was allegedly not quite as good as it could be? I am sorry she is disappointed but I think she needs to take it on the chin, perhaps learn from it and try to get behind the team and support them. I think those who are observing from the side lines need to do the same thing. I wish every one the best of luck and I am sure Sue will live to fight another day. Jane Wilson | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Andy Poole |
Who am I? I am a spectator who has no gain from who ever is selected all I have done is put forward what It looks like from the outside. Nothing I have said has been snide. All I have done is write what I have seen, heard and read. Any critism has been in the open except where it has been censored. That alone makes debate cloudy and biased and poses questions about integrity. Nothing has been snide. Is has been upfront from my experience as an observ. Whilst watching the events. As for the reference to "monetary gain" that is not snide it is an observation that there are other influences to take into concern. According to the BHDTA selection proceedure "The team trainers and vets will act in an advisory capacity at all stages of the selection process. If this didn't happen are you saying the proceedure wasn't followed and there advice was not used. Looking at this as an independent observer it looks like you cant ask questions raise concerns about what they see and hear at event and on the official web site. It is asked who I am? I don't see the relevance in this unless only certain people can ask questions. It is yourselves painting this picture To an independent spectator who enjoys watching/following a sport. I would be more concerned about the image the sport portrays to people like myself. Or do you not want spectators. Spectators play an important role in all sports and all that I have done (I repeat) is put done my experience and observations. Looking at this thread I am obviiously not the only person who has concerns, so the image portrayed is not just seem by one person. You may have minutes to meetings etc, but that is only one perspective. What about chats over lunch, over a drink etc. Do you have those minutes. Of course it will only be documented what people want to be seem. I cant imagine anyone would stand up in a meeting and say for example "I would believe this person should represent us because they buy a Tack from my shop" (that is ment to be a ludicrous example as people would read what they want from an example related to a plausible situation). I see that you are trying to make all the challenges made on this site go away by saying we should support who has been selected and I am sure that will be done. The eventuall team will be supported. But that doesn't mean the selection proceeedure cant be questioned? The proceedure must still be looked at even if a full investigation continues after the Championships. The team will have been supported but there will still be questions about integrity and transparency of the selection proceedure. Finally you seem to have ignored the other point of the email.People being disgruntled with the BHDTA which is an observation off this site. and.. You cant be that certain that the same result would be recieved if an independant body were able to review the facts. Otherwise that would demonstrate the confidence of the delection committee and the integrity of the decisions made. Instead you suggest ignoring the questions posed by many people and just support the decision. What confidence will that put in people who would like to be put up for selection next time? The first censored post explained my experience at Farleigh. But my experience was not to be allowed to be seem. Is this a sport or some deep political structure? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
May I ask a question ? Just who is this Andy Pooley? Pete Blanchard | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
I am completely appalled at Andy Pooleys' last post and the scurrilous accusations he is making. I have offered to make available all the minutes and records of discussions leading up to the decision to adopt a selection committee rather than a first past the post selection procedure. So far no one has asked for the facts (including Andy Pooley who appears to just prefer to make snide remarks) but just for the record 1. Everyone up for selection has had lessons and attended clinics with Robert Buck for which he was paid not by the BHDTA but by the competitors themselves - Julie is not the only one to have contributed to his 'monetary gain' 2. Robert's was not the only voice on the selection committee and in fact the trainers were deliberatly excluded from the decision making process to specifically avoid the kind of accusations Andy is making - they (and Karen Bassett is also a trainer who is paid for her expertise) were only there in an advisory capacity but since they have both closely monitored the progress of all competitors over the last two years, how stupid would it have been for the selectors not to have taken advantage of that information? 3. The BHDTA council did not want to adopt this kind of selection procedure as they felt that the membership were not mature enough to accept the decision of experienced and impartial selectors (and sadly, how right they were!)It was actually pushed through by the (consulted and well informed) competitors themselves. At every stage they were able to voice concerns and the procedure which was finally adopted had actually been changed several times to address competitors concerns. 4. The procedure was transparent at all stages to the competitors who were up for selection. They have had the opportunity to discuss their progress and the development of their ponies with the selectors for the last two years. The training clinics have been available to all and at the end of last season everyone on the longlist was invited to, and most attended, a clinic where individual progress was discussed with trainers and selectors, with team vets monitoring all ponies throughout. How much more transparent do you want to be? 5. I have not been around driving trials this year so have not seen first hand what has been going on but I do respect the the selectors' competetence and what must have been for them a very difficult decision to make - as several others have commented how fantastic that over the last two years of training so many potential team members have emerged. That was exactly what the process was designed to do - not only to make available a group of competitors who could go to the next world championships but to develop another group who would be ready for the one after that and the one after that. I think enough has now been said on this subject and it is now time, as others have said, to support our British team. Rosemary Neale | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Andy Poole |
I have read this post with a great deal of interest. After my initial post was removed I was unsure about the openness of a forum if the was censorship. But I did get an email from Mike Watts about why that action was taken and I respect what I was told. It now looks like there are two issues being discussed in thread. 1. The suitablility of the structure and running of the governing body. 2. The selection process. Firstly my observations are that there should be transparency and integritty in any elected body. As was stated earlier this is not the case with some elected bodies. But at the end of the day this a reletavly small organisation, for a sport. I cant see why integrity and tranpareny are not at the fore front of all there policies. Otherwise it begs the question "What have you to hide?" I would like to say that if nothing else you would think that we could look at the selection and see a level playing field. Hre are a few questions? Who is the advisor/trainer for the selection committee/team? Robert Buck. Does he receive any monetry gain from anyone up for selection? Yes. Training and Stabling fees from Julie Camm Could that influence his advice to the selection committee. Maybe not, but maybe so. On that alone we cant trust the decisions made? People are saying we should put all this behind us and move on supporting the team selected. Very honourable. But if there is as much dis satisfaction as there seems. Why dont the selectors allow an independent body review the selection decisions with full facts? If they are certain that they have made the right decision then they must be confident that an indipendant review would come to the same conclusiion as them. One final point. If people are so unsatisfied with the governing body why was there such a low turn out at the AGM. If people feel as strongly as they say why don't they stand together in the name of change. I don't hear the cry of "I am spartacus" and I get the feeling I wont in the future. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Viki Edmondson |
Inevitably there is always going to be criticism of who has been selected to go to ANY WOrld Championship. The ONLY time this wll not happen is when there are enough qualified people to ONLY fill ALL the available places. Having assessed all the ponies at Farleigh with regard to their overall health and sonudness in hand (which was not the Brits strongest point 2 years ago) I can only say that the overall standard of the ponies presented to me has improved almost beyond words. The Single Horse points system picked the gold medal winning team but not the individual gold medalist. Time to look ahead to Denmark and give those competitors who ARE going all the support we can. If the team does not come back with a medal then don't forget there are at lest 3 athletes (one hopes) involved in the equation - the pony(ies, the driver and the backstepper(s). An off day - which without exception we all have - could alter the results dramatically. Having sat in on a selectors meeting after the veterinary inspection at Farleigh I was very impressed with the thoroughness, fairness, honesty and complete lack of any bias that all the discussions were highlighted by. GOOD LUCK TO THE BRITISH TEAM. Viki Edmondson MRCVS | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Alan Hodges |
Thanks for that John. In my opinion there is no such thing as a benign dictator, just a dictator. The difference between someone who believes they are helping others and someone who is helping themselves is pretty marginal when their views are imposed without proper debate. I am not a great supporter of the BHDTA these days, but in this particular instance it appears the pony competitors got the selection system they wanted, and by democratic procedures too so thats fine by me. Perhaps its now the time to rally behind those individuals who have been selected, offer words of support and encouragement and worry about fine tuning the selection process after the event has run its course. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
My apologies to Mr Hodges for not signing my "POST".I can assure him that I do not scare that easily.This was an oversite that I am happy to correct. JOHN GAYNOR | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Alan Hodges |
A load of rubbish from someone who is too scared to put their name to it. The whole point of a forum is to enjoy an open and frank debate, and in order to have a debate there have to be two sides. It's perfectly reasonable for the moderator to remove anything which they consider to be illegal, but wrong if it's just contentious. I did not see the removed post but the wording of Mike Watts message leads one to believe that the latter case applied. Beware censorship, it's the start of the rot. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
The "selection" procedure for the single horses produced a Team "GOLD" and the individual "GOLD" ! Do council feel that they can improve on the selection proccess? To not anticipate the very predictable reaction from competitors when the final selection was made was naive in the extreme. How can so many intelligent people who collectivly have been on this earth for so long still have no understanding of human nature? To use the excuse that Pony classes voted for this system does not wash. When anything "hits the fan" the governing body takes responsibility. We see attempts at "democracy" failing all over the world. In certain situations a "benign dictatorship" works better. I would suggest that the BHDTA is one such situation !! P.S. I also think this "Forum" page is a really bad idea. I see that a form of censorship has already taken someone's comments off the site. Ill imformed / rude comments were as predictable as the problems with the selection procedure !! | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
As a follower ( although not competitor) of the sport for more than 20 years I've seen all the emails re Sue and Sarah and could not agree more that the selectors have made a terrible mistake -however they have also made an equally bad mistake with the pony teams -Colin Alan certainly deserves a place for his Marathon - but where does that leave Sarah Jane Cook? I don't think that she has won a dressage for a while now and there are others who have cones scores which match hers. Overall the team selection appears to have gone severly awry - I think that this needs full investigation before it is too late! I probably won't attend another event due to my lack of confidence in the organisers of this sport! Mark Deacon | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
I have been following this thread for a while, although I didn't see the original post which started it off, and after some thought have decided to add my comments. I was assitant chef d'equipe at both Karlstetton and Catton and it was the experiences of competitors, trainers, chefs, and vets at these competitons which lead to the recommendation to change the selection process from first past the post to a more flexible system to achieve the best possible team for the competition and the way in which it was scored. An additional factor was the knowledge that the next champs would be in Denmark, a long journey away and it was felt that the first past the post system lead to some ponies peaking too early and arriving at the competition exhausted from chasing points to get selected. The whole process was arrived at as a result of a lengthy wash-up session after Catton and was discussed and consulted on with all the pony competitors before it even went to Council so to accuse the BHDTA of 'bullyboy tactics' is not only unfair but completely inaccurate. I should just add that at the moment I am not a supporter of the BHDTA for all sorts of reasons but this is not one of them! I have kept all my emails and papers relating to the selection procedure and also the minutes of the wash-up session and would be happy to share them with anyone who would like to know more. Rosemary Neale | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Georgina Frith |
I am sorry i have only caught up with this thread after the initial post has been taken down. I am sure the selectors have very good reasons for their choice and it must be hard for them not to jump on here and itemise them. I applaud the ponies for recognising that the rules of the Worlds means that using a first past the post selection system might not achieve the best pick and i hope the significance of the scoring system is understood by the objectors. We all prefer things to be clear cut. Nobody disputes their marathon or cones scores, but we are all guilty of trying to blame the judges for our dressage! The selectors are in exactly the same position. It is a thankless task that involves a lot of time and heart ache. The pony classes turned to them as dedicated enthusiasts with interest and experience in the hope that they could make a prediction of performance in Denmark that a simple points system could not achieve. How nice that there were several people competing at such a high level to make the choice really difficult! Could we not focus on that and wish them luck | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Tracey Robson |
I am new to this sport and we completed our first full year at Club last year and have progressed into Novice and have tired a few Novice Qualifiers. While I understand the frustrations of everyone I do think a vote of no Confidence is a little strong, we do have to remember that a lot of people are giving up their time for free. Negative feedback all the time is not always the best way of moving things forward. As a novice I have found the qualifiers a little confusing and have decided to stay competing at club level at least for the rest of this year, we are probably a little out of our depth. Where the events are cheaper and we have had immense amounts of fun and support. We need to focus on the positive aspects of the sport and look at the negatives and change them into positives for the majority. If I was running this as my business I would recommend a survey to find out why people are so unhappy with the running of the sport and then look at ways to move it forward. Getting sample groups of people for work shops to discuss the problems is also a good way to come up with ideas. I would be happy to join in. This is a wonderful fun sport which my whole family gets involved with, I have had horses and ponies for 30 years and this is the first time my parents have ever come to watch. I am may be a little naive and new to this but I am sure there is a lot that we could do to change the sport for the better. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
Well, here we go again just reading the comments that have been posted we are looking at another sham by the selection committee and the BHDTA I’m sorry for Julie Camm as she has done well with her pony but I think we all know Sue Denny and Sarah Howe should be going to the worlds, but I have to say Sue has not done her self any favors with her reactions at times to dressage markings etc………….but yes she should be the person going.(as her results show) As I’m sure the Committee are aware there changes and bully boy behavior is starting to get members backs up and certain committee members seem to be behaving like Tony Blair and dictating to us, but even Tony knows when to resign !! I think we are now seeing the demise of the BHDTA under the current structure with entries falling in all classes especially novice (our future) and the people who run the events having issues with the new financial structure, I don’t see the BHDTA lasting much longer than two years, we need to encourage new blood and youngsters in to our sport now not in two or three years time it will be to late by then. Perhaps we are getting to the stage where we as members should consider a vote of no confidence of the structure/committee? If you feel the same way you should also voice your concerns on this web site so perhaps we can get the committee or should I say the Dictators to realize we are not happy and changes need to be made now………...or let people run it who have the ability to listen to the membership and make decisions for the long term future and good of the sport Although the above is quite strong I feel its now come to the stage that the structure we are currently competing under is not working and has not been accepted and needs to be revised for next year to make it affordable for people to compete and get the entries up. WJD | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Jean Lane |
I am sorry, but my feelings have been discussed over dinner many times in the past, with various people from the council of the time.... Regarding competitors and their animals, being 'run ragged' going from event to event, just to 'qualify' or be 'selected' for international. I personally think it is an honour to represent your country, but having to 'jump through hoops to do so' and in the meantime maybe ruin your animal to that expense, I feel is not worth it!!! Surely there must be a better system..... If Sue and Sara are due to go, then so be it - what is the problem?? The figures speak for themselves...... | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
i agree with andy completely if you look at the results sue denney and sarah howe should go to denmark. Joe M. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Andy Poole |
I am sorry if the BHDTA Office didn't like what was in my initial post. However I can only post what my experience was. Looking at the posting put on since though it does pose even my question, putting aside my experience a Farleigh. Why is Sue Denney not on the team at least as the individual competitor? If the results are looked at at specialised ares. Who has consistently won dressage, marathon and cones (number of Double Clears)? Julie Camm and Liz Rowe have both missed event and still are no nearer to Sue Denney and Sarah Howe on Points. So lets look at the average per competition entered. Sue Denney 2 Sarah Howe 2 Julie Camm 5.75 Liz Rowe 4 The result reflect even worse when we break the results down like this. What is going on? or has gone on? Yes I am British and have the best interests of our nation at heart in this sport.But I ask myself and ask others to look at the results and say if they think we will with the selections made. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Moderator |
The post which started this thread has been removed at the request of the BHDTA office. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Guest |
The selection for the pony worlds involved six selection events - the overall placings in these are below - Farleigh wasn't published at the time of writing. The pony selection process was published as: "Selection to be made on the basis of observation at selection events of which competitors are required to compete at FOUR. Other considerations such as experience and temperament of driver, age and soundness of ponies etc. will be taken into account if final selection is not clear-cut." Certainly if the published horse selection process were used the results would be clear cut and include Sue Denney. The horse scheme is: " .. best three results to be counted... Points to be awarded according to final event placing i.e. 1st place = 1 point, 2nd place = 2 points etc." It looks as if the pony selection uses a different scheme and it would help encourage pony competitors if the pony selection is explained.
|