| Author | Message | ||
     Janet Pilling Member Username: Janetp Post Number: 48 Registered: 03-2007 |
Very valid points Deborah. Mike's horse is an inexperienced 17hh and he is a fairly experienced driver :o) The original question was about front brakes. I think most people buying a new carriage would be looking for at least back brakes now and from a re-sale angle it would be a bad move not to have them fitted. I personally drive a 13.2 power house who is 19 and very clever with his use of his breeching but I do use my brakes to keep the weight of the carriage off him at times, particularly in turns in obstacles as it allows him to keep the forward motion. If I can take care of the carriage it frees him up to make tighter turns. | ||
| DEBORAH DANIEL Member Username: Deb_daniel Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2012 |
Dear Mike, you started this thread on a very basic note. As Fiona Powell asked, I don't know what you are driving, or at what level, I APOLOGISE for that but if 'IT IS A SINGLE' an in particular a pony.....how about 'basically' training it to respect it's breeching for a start?? You may find this strange but as a para driver of '13'1' h ponies only, I do not use a brake!! I am only slightly limited ofcourse downhill with certain terrain, but should they not know how to respect their commands. I can not tell you how irritating it is for me to hear a brake squeeking in dressage at walk or halt etc etc. Yes on a higher lever and more impulsion with more horse power I understand requirements.....but are you worrying too much about technicalities of a vehicle before the equine? And way before all the responses that have been written in 'red mist' why have not the more experienced people who have replied suggested this?? I am no slouch on a marathon and can't believe as no one knows your level, other than Fiona, have suggested this! HORSE POWER!! | ||
| Patti Atkinson Member Username: Pattia Post Number: 26 Registered: 03-2007 |
Most discussion forums have a moderator and posts are frequently removed for various reasons, mainly for being rude about someone or something. Most forums remove the whole thread, not just one part. Forums often get closed completely because of comments made in the heat of the moment. Please keep things friendly and fair and we can all benefit. | ||
| Alan Hodges Member Username: Alan Post Number: 7 Registered: 03-2007 |
This is a discussion forum and should not be censored. I think the BHDTA should delete the post by Mark Broadbent on the basis that it says Fenix carriages are wonderful and as such should be regarded as advertising. | ||
| Mary Kusin Member Username: Maryk Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2007 |
The BHDTA have removed a post from the Discussion Forum which was adversely affecting the business of a reputable carriage manufacturer. They wish to make it clear that the claims made in this post by the individual concerned are his own views and relate to modifications made to the original vehicle without the manufacturer’s knowledge or approval. | ||
| Robin Hyde-Chambers Member Username: Rhc1 Post Number: 3 Registered: 03-2012 |
I thought this was Mike Browns thread about 3 phase single carriages having front brakes. Asking for peoples views, opinions and experiences with them. that is all everyone on here has done. If it makes anyone feel better i have tipped over many a polish vehicle, broke there springs, twisted there shafts and had them snap in half on me. I don't think anyone including myself has any problem concerning the excellence in service, quality and fantastic product produced by many carriage manufacturers, especially in the UK. This is the first time i have actually been bothered or interested enough to post anything on here. And would suggest the thread is good and free, but should refer back to the original question and not make mountains out of mole hills. | ||
| Joanna Broadbent Member Username: Jobroadbent Post Number: 4 Registered: 11-2009 |
Hi, this is Mark Broadbent. In answer to the original question, front brakes are perfectly safe if fitted by the manufacturer. To get a few facts straight, The Fenix carriage mentioned in an earlier post by David Taylor had not been seen by Fenix carriages for approx 10 years, and the brakes were fitted by somebody else, not Fenix, and were far to heavy and bulky for the lightweight carriage. These should not have been fitted, and I would advise all owners to always consult the manufacture before modifying carriages in any way. Davids earlier post, as it is so misleading, should be deleted by the BHDTA; unfortunately some damage is already done. People should be aware that search engines also pick up on forum posts, which can be very negative for businesses if incorrect facts are posted through ignorance. | ||
| Robin Hyde-Chambers Member Username: Rhc1 Post Number: 2 Registered: 03-2012 |
I don't believe David was commenting in a negative way about Fenix. On the contrary I believe he loves the one he's had. Just that he happened to be driving on at this time. (It does have rear brakes).Unfortunate, but not a comment against the qaulity of a great Fenix product. Anyone can have this problem in any make or size of carriage. Going back to the orginal issue raised, I have driven most carriages from tiny to enormous and have always found rear brakes are more than sufficient. Front brakes are not bad but aren't neccesary and can cause a problem. I;e if your horse bolts and you slam your foot to the pedals and catch the front brake you will tip, regardless of what vehicle it is. Because these marathon vehicles are so light the brakes will only work to the point when the wheels lock. the rear wheels locking creates drag. not a problem. the fronts lock and you may tip up. Ultimately it is what ever you feel safe with. All carriage manufacturers bar non will build they're carriages with your safety in mind. | ||
| Matt Were Member Username: Mattwere Post Number: 3 Registered: 09-2009 |
I drive a Fenix Flyer (2010D) I use the same carriage to school my 3 horses 6 day's a week as I do to compete in indoors and out it's probably fair to say that mine is one of the higher mileage 2010D Flyers and it drives as well today as it did the day I brought it. I push it to my limits in competition and I can say it has always been rock solid and performed superbly and has definitely been a major factor to my results. My carriage is NOT fitted with front brakes by Fenix and I wouldn't have them on any single carriage. The after sales service from Fenix is second to none and I wouldn't swap my Fenix for any other carriage on the circuit. | ||
| Joanna Broadbent Member Username: Jobroadbent Post Number: 3 Registered: 11-2009 |
I would like to say to anyone considering a Fenix carriage, the weight distribution and stability are second to none. Although Davids accident was unfortunate perhaps there were other factors involved. Negitive comments towards British companys who support our sport is dissapointing. Customer service is very important and we were not informed of this accident at the time. FENIX DID NOT FIT THE BRAKES ON THIS CARRIAGE and it did not have any rear bakes. Anyone interested in a Fenix carriage should try one of our carriages and make there own mind up. I promise you will not be dissapionted in the quality, stability, customer service and value for money. | ||
| David Taylor Member Username: Davidt Post Number: 7 Registered: 02-2007 |
Hi - the other factor is that the traction Traces) is above the axle level- in fact level with the top of the wheels whereas in days of old it was often off the axle | ||
| Alan Hodges Member Username: Alan Post Number: 6 Registered: 03-2007 |
Glad to hear the rays don't get to you. I think the stories about vehicles "flipping" is not so much about the axle the brakes are on but a result of bad weight distribution. Commonsense dictates that there should always be a body on the backstep of a competion type 4wheeler when it's being driven | ||
| Kathleen Upsall Member Username: Katastrophy Post Number: 46 Registered: 10-2008 |
Alan- safe to say there's no fear of me in a tin foil hat, I always drive in a current standard hard hat so the rays bounce right off... I do believe David has just reiterated the point that my instructor had. I'm also not entirely sure that I would do half the things with my pony and carriage that I do with my car (as I've just written one off and driven the second into a gate and my pony is far more precious to me than they are!!) as the car has brakes all round to assist with downhill braking, ABS and doesn't confuse me with two brake pedals... :D | ||
| Alan Hodges Member Username: Alan Post Number: 5 Registered: 03-2007 |
If you believe that Kathleen I expect you also wear a tinfoil hat to stop the rays. Why don't cars fall end over end when braking on a hill? They have front brakes! | ||
| Kathleen Upsall Member Username: Katastrophy Post Number: 45 Registered: 10-2008 |
My old instructor told me never ever to have front brakes on a 4 wheeler and if I bought one with them to remove the pedal. The reasoning being that if you stand on them especially downhill, the back of the carriage can flip- he competed for years back in the 80's. I haven't seen any used so can not comment- but id never buy one with them, only back ones. | ||
| Fiona Powell Member Username: Fionap Post Number: 123 Registered: 03-2007 |
Hi, Mike, I drive 13-hand ponies and I find rear brakes are enough for a single, where I want a light weight, and I like front and rear on my pairs carriage. I see a lot of small pony vehicles that have all the bells and whistles and end up being very heavy. I think the overall balance of the carriage is most important. I don't know how fast you are planning to go but some of the pony vehicles tend to be back-heavy and the front wheels can come off the ground easily when you turn fast and tight and then accelerate. I don't know if this is as much of a problem with horse vehicles...? p.s. get a heavier groom to keep the back down? Then you won't go over the handle-bars! | ||
| chris manger Member Username: Chrismanger Post Number: 3 Registered: 01-2012 |
I would say you are worrying about nothing. I have never had any instability issues with front brakes (medium to large vehicles). If you only have One set of brakes you have more chance of locking the wheels up rather than braking with all for wheels. | ||
| Mike Brown Member Username: Mikebrown Post Number: 2 Registered: 09-2008 |
Hi All, I'm in the process of getting a new 3 phase single carriage and can't decide on front brakes - my first instinct is not to have them as I worry a bit about stability if I inadvertently hit the wrong pedal a bit hard going down hill (bad memories of going over handlebars when young!)... Are there any massive advantages to having them? Am I worrying about nothing? Any input gratefully appreciated! Cheers, Mike |